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#1 Saturday 12th April 2014 15:08:00

(ROG)
Verified Member
From: LEICESTER
Registered: Monday 23rd August 2010
Posts: 1,551

B teaching for B+E test = legal?

I cannot find any legal restriction for not doing this made up scenario ....

Instructor for B+E has only a B licence, is age 21 and passed B test at age 17

They use a vehicle with a GVW of 2100, a towing capacity of 1600 and a box trailer with a MAM of 1400 and an empty weight of 600
The trailer is loaded sandbags weighing 600


I can find nothing which prevents this ... or have I missed something?

Last edited by (ROG) (Saturday 12th April 2014 15:09:01)


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Saturday 12th April 2014 15:08:00

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Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?



#2 Saturday 12th April 2014 15:37:46

pegasus
Verified Member
From: north west
Registered: Friday 25th February 2005
Posts: 3,318

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

Hi Rog
It looks legal.
One question has he managed to find any sand/agregate etc in bags which have official weight markings???? big_smile

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#3 Saturday 12th April 2014 19:25:04

Daveyboy
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From: Nr Alford, Lincolnshire
Registered: Sunday 25th January 2009
Posts: 377

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

If only 21 years old they have no licence to drive B+E as they have no grandfather rights.

So unless they have passed their test on B+E they can't drive it or instruct on the Cat of vehicle.

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#4 Saturday 12th April 2014 20:27:37

pegasus
Verified Member
From: north west
Registered: Friday 25th February 2005
Posts: 3,318

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

Hi
They can drive that combinbation without B+E.
Though after having a re-think they can't instruct if they don't have the category.
If they go out and get the category, they can even teach themselves and drive to the TC solo, they can then instruct without an ADI badge

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#5 Sunday 13th April 2014 07:46:24

reddragonbus
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From: Edinburgh
Registered: Sunday 5th February 2006
Posts: 1,660

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

Yes and they can also supervise a provisional cat D driver using a routemaster bus.


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#6 Sunday 13th April 2014 11:38:27

trunkmonkey
Member
Registered: Thursday 5th March 2009
Posts: 754

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

(ROG) wrote:

I cannot find any legal restriction for not doing this made up scenario ....

Instructor for B+E has only a B licence, is age 21 and passed B test at age 17

They use a vehicle with a GVW of 2100, a towing capacity of 1600 and a box trailer with a MAM of 1400 and an empty weight of 600
The trailer is loaded sandbags weighing 600


I can find nothing which prevents this ... or have I missed something?

have I missed something?

You'd need to confirm the unladen weight of the vehicle, which mustn't be less than 1400kgs.

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#7 Monday 14th April 2014 13:57:46

(ROG)
Verified Member
From: LEICESTER
Registered: Monday 23rd August 2010
Posts: 1,551

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

trunkmonkey wrote:
(ROG) wrote:

I cannot find any legal restriction for not doing this made up scenario ....

Instructor for B+E has only a B licence, is age 21 and passed B test at age 17

They use a vehicle with a GVW of 2100, a towing capacity of 1600 and a box trailer with a MAM of 1400 and an empty weight of 600
The trailer is loaded sandbags weighing 600


I can find nothing which prevents this ... or have I missed something?

have I missed something?

You'd need to confirm the unladen weight of the vehicle, which mustn't be less than 1400kgs.

2100 GVW would normally mean an unladen weight about 1600


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Leicester group of advanced motorists
LGV instructor from 2005 to 2008

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#8 Monday 14th April 2014 14:00:54

(ROG)
Verified Member
From: LEICESTER
Registered: Monday 23rd August 2010
Posts: 1,551

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

pegasus wrote:

Hi
They can drive that combinbation without B+E.
Though after having a re-think they can't instruct if they don't have the category.
If they go out and get the category, they can even teach themselves and drive to the TC solo, they can then instruct without an ADI badge

The set up is a B but they are teaching for the B+E - is there a law which prevents that?

I know the law says they must have the licence for the set up they are using


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Leicester group of advanced motorists
LGV instructor from 2005 to 2008

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#9 Monday 14th April 2014 18:46:29

reddragonbus
Verified Member
From: Edinburgh
Registered: Sunday 5th February 2006
Posts: 1,660

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

Question really is do they actually need a driving licence at all to teach it?

If the driver does not need supervised the instructor doesn't actually need to hold a licence to drive the vehicle.


LGV PCV Instructor DVSA ADI Fleet

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#10 Tuesday 15th April 2014 13:52:35

dog
Verified Member
Registered: Sunday 29th October 2006
Posts: 813

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

trunkmonkey wrote:
(ROG) wrote:

I cannot find any legal restriction for not doing this made up scenario ....

Instructor for B+E has only a B licence, is age 21 and passed B test at age 17

They use a vehicle with a GVW of 2100, a towing capacity of 1600 and a box trailer with a MAM of 1400 and an empty weight of 600
The trailer is loaded sandbags weighing 600


I can find nothing which prevents this ... or have I missed something?

have I missed something?

You'd need to confirm the unladen weight of the vehicle, which mustn't be less than 1400kgs.

Easy, my car is 1700kg unladen and 2195kg MAM, with a towing capacity of 1900kg, without B+E you could tow a fully loaded 1300kg MAM trailer which would satisfy the vehicle requirement for the B+E test.

Since ROG points out that it is easily possible to have a vehicle/trailer combination which meets the requirements for the B+E test but can be driven without B+E then I see no reason why a B licence holder could not "train" someone else (providing they are over 21 with licence 4 years). In the same way that you could train yourself, go for the test, put L plates on and then drive away afterwards without the L plates regardless of  pass or fail.

If it's all insured and legal then I can't see why it isn't a problem. After all you are not teaching in a category you do not have yourself, you are just allowing a friend to drive your car (also legally) and giving them advice.

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#11 Tuesday 15th April 2014 13:56:35

dog
Verified Member
Registered: Sunday 29th October 2006
Posts: 813

Re: B teaching for B+E test = legal?

reddragonbus wrote:

Question really is do they actually need a driving licence at all to teach it?

If the driver does not need supervised the instructor doesn't actually need to hold a licence to drive the vehicle.

^ this is a good point. If the "learner" is driving within the limits of their licence, then why does the supervisor even need a licence? If they are towing within the limits of B only, then it's no different from just driving a car. And if you already have a licence to do that, then why do you need a licensed supervisor? You can just do it on your own as I stated above.

Last edited by dog (Tuesday 15th April 2014 13:56:48)

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