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#1 Thursday 20th December 2012 16:39:57

Lady-Hynarc
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Registered: Monday 9th April 2012
Posts: 650

New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

In the latest issue of Despatch there is an 'article' about proposals regarding changing the check test.  Has anyone else seen this?  Has this been discussed already (and I've missed it)?  Initial reactions?

Despatch

It's on page 3...

Last edited by Lady-Hynarc (Thursday 20th December 2012 16:51:57)

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Thursday 20th December 2012 16:39:57

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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!



#2 Thursday 20th December 2012 17:03:46

daz6215
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Posts: 449

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

DSA is developing proposals to improve ADI check tests and better align them with the National driver and rider training standard. The aim is to provide a more realistic assessment and a more rounded evaluation of the ADIs ability to teach

It would seem that the DSA think the check test is unrealistic by their own omission!

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#3 Thursday 20th December 2012 17:46:36

Daveyboy
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From: Nr Alford, Lincolnshire
Registered: Sunday 25th January 2009
Posts: 377

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

I note they intend consult on the end of role play CT.

Although I have never taken a role play CT, I believe it should be an option.

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#4 Thursday 20th December 2012 17:56:23

Roadmaster
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Registered: Thursday 4th March 2004
Posts: 5,678

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

Change of staff, change of attitude.   Trevor Wedge was always going on about how the checktest should be role play to stop ADI's being able to 'practice a checktest lesson.

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#5 Saturday 22nd December 2012 00:03:58

hayjay2112
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From: chester
Registered: Wednesday 21st November 2012
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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

Had mine the other day which was role play, he mentioned that the ct's would be going yearly and yes this option would be removed as they want to see more real life, although i agree with the fact it allows those to practice and ends up not being real life. If role play is done, you would then have to just base it on what fault examiner plays which would then test your ability a lot more.

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#6 Saturday 22nd December 2012 08:08:33

Roadmaster
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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

hayjay2112 wrote:

Had mine the other day which was role play, he mentioned that the ct's would be going yearly and yes this option would be removed as they want to see more real life, although i agree with the fact it allows those to practice and ends up not being real life. If role play is done, you would then have to just base it on what fault examiner plays which would then test your ability a lot more.

Every real life lesson is a practice lesson.    As for yearly ct's you should never listen to examiners, they know less than ADIs about what is going on.

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#7 Saturday 22nd December 2012 09:21:02

hayjay2112
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From: chester
Registered: Wednesday 21st November 2012
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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

I agree with it being practice lessons etc, but my point being there are those out there that would especially prepare those for the test just to play the game, in order to gain that good grade, is this right? does this really show the true standards of the instructor? And as far as listening to examiners, we all know that all of this is proposed, which means untill it is agreed and implemented then it might or might not.

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#8 Saturday 22nd December 2012 12:02:10

Roadmaster
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Posts: 5,678

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

hayjay2112 wrote:

I agree with it being practice lessons etc, but my point being there are those out there that would especially prepare those for the test just to play the game, in order to gain that good grade, is this right? does this really show the true standards of the instructor?

The checktest is a game.  It's a tick box game.   As for preparing for it is that not what you should do for any exam?

hayjay2112 wrote:

And as far as listening to examiners, we all know that all of this is proposed, which means untill it is agreed and implemented then it might or might not

There has never been any proposal that checktests would be done annually.

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#9 Saturday 22nd December 2012 12:16:18

Daveyboy
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From: Nr Alford, Lincolnshire
Registered: Sunday 25th January 2009
Posts: 377

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

As someone who sees minutes from Modernising Driver/Rider Training meetings. It has never been mentioned that CTs would or could be yearly, it has never been proposed.

It has however been mentioned that your ADI green badge could run for 5 years, this was mentioned I believe to coincide with LGV driver CPC. This has however not been mentioned at any further meetings.

DSA do not have the logistics and finances to carry out a yearly CT.

I believe the cost of a CT to DSA is around 125, with simple maths, if carried out yearly cost to DSA per ADI 500. Either the green badge is going up which by the way it isnt as the government wont allow it, or the DSA will be doing them at a loss, and theres no chance of that.

It has been proposed that an ADI could have a CT by paying separately. This was proposed as some ADIs carryout work for companies that require an ADI of grade 5 or 6. Should an ADI be graded at 4 then the opportunity would be there for them to try again to achieve a 5 or 6. It would also be possible to go down in grades as well as up. So beware.

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#10 Saturday 22nd December 2012 19:17:22

hayjay2112
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From: chester
Registered: Wednesday 21st November 2012
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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

That is interesting Daveyboy, but this surely poses a problem in policing the instructors out there? How can this be done?

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#11 Wednesday 26th December 2012 20:14:38

slick285
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Registered: Wednesday 16th August 2006
Posts: 25

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

Just got my letter through the post and my next check test is in February 2013, when are these proposed changes meant to be happening?

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#12 Wednesday 26th December 2012 20:48:46

Daveyboy
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From: Nr Alford, Lincolnshire
Registered: Sunday 25th January 2009
Posts: 377

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

slick285

It's only the way DSA mark the CT thats changing.

They (the DSA) say that the new forms will give better feed back to the ADI.

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#13 Wednesday 26th December 2012 21:16:09

Terrier
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Registered: Sunday 15th May 2011
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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

This could also affect grades because the markings are moving over to a client centred approach and therefore the instructors performance in this area could affect the final grade. I'm not saying an adi would fail the check test for not incorporating this into the tuition because it won't be compulsory, but if may influence the final grade.


ADI Development Greater Manchester & Cheshire Grade 6 ORDIT Approved
Cardington Grade A  RoSPA Gold
DSA External Trainer Certificate for Instructor Training

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#14 Wednesday 26th December 2012 22:10:16

Coasting Mart
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Registered: Thursday 11th June 2009
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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

the markings are moving over to a client centred approach

Well, as long as the DSA actually define what they mean by this, fine.  Which particular set of words, theories, models, bull do they want us to wrap up our work in now?  Where are we supposed to discover what they mean by the terms?  roll


"I swear I found the key to the universe in the engine of an old parked car"

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#15 Thursday 27th December 2012 09:07:51

martin Williams
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Registered: Friday 26th June 2009
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Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

Terrier wrote:

This could also affect grades because the markings are moving over to a client centred approach and therefore the instructors performance in this area could affect the final grade. I'm not saying an adi would fail the check test for not incorporating this into the tuition because it won't be compulsory, but if may influence the final grade.

Where have you read that grades could be affected can you give us a link please?

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#16 Thursday 27th December 2012 16:52:07

Terrier
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From: Greater Manchester
Registered: Sunday 15th May 2011
Posts: 657

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

I've not read this anywhere, it comes from someone very senior in DSA, but nothing official has been released. In 26 years of dealing with DSA, this is the way they tend to introduce changes to the system and adi's only discover what they want when it affects them, the changes tend to filter through very slowly over a period of time until everyone catches up.

Very similar things happened when they introduced bay parking, the theory test and various other changes over the years, it's a case of suck it and see, adi's are never given the full facts from DSA just in case they've got it wrong.


ADI Development Greater Manchester & Cheshire Grade 6 ORDIT Approved
Cardington Grade A  RoSPA Gold
DSA External Trainer Certificate for Instructor Training

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#17 Thursday 27th December 2012 17:39:25

Daveyboy
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From: Nr Alford, Lincolnshire
Registered: Sunday 25th January 2009
Posts: 377

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

DSA did announce these changes at a meeting (01/03/12) of Modernising Driver/Rider Training earlier this year.

If you were unaware of the changes, you should get on to your representative at these meetings.

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#18 Thursday 27th December 2012 19:40:06

Terrier
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From: Greater Manchester
Registered: Sunday 15th May 2011
Posts: 657

Re: New Check Test? Sorry, Standards Check!

Daveyboy wrote:

DSA did announce these changes at a meeting (01/03/12) of Modernising Driver/Rider Training earlier this year.

If you were unaware of the changes, you should get on to your representative at these meetings.

Daveyboy,

I'm not referring to the announcement about the change in marking, I'm well aware of that, I was talking about how the change may affect the c/t grade because of the method of assessment change. It's always been the way DSA do things, they never give adi's enough info about the effect of changes, it just tends to get filtered through to adi's by means of check test and other methods.

Despite all the so called meetings with representatives, DSA never give enough info for adi's to make proper adjustments to their normal practice. It was just the same with the last change of independent driving, there was so much confusion about what was acceptable on test, and that wasn't just with adi's, it was with the de's out in the field, in particular, with special needs test and that's because it was not thought out properly by DSA before introducing it. it's always a case of lets do it and sort out the problems later, usually at the expense of adi's and pupils, and it looks as if that's what will happen with the new c/t assessment.


ADI Development Greater Manchester & Cheshire Grade 6 ORDIT Approved
Cardington Grade A  RoSPA Gold
DSA External Trainer Certificate for Instructor Training

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